Moving into my 2018 Mac mini questions

Pat Schaefer wrote:

#1 is done, the Mac mini has a ssd drive. I bought a ssd drive to use with it but don't plan to.

Not sure why you wouldn't. There's little to no downside to using an SSD. They might be problematic if you need to recover data from a failed drive because they store data differently than HDD, but with a backup strategy in place that issue is moot.

#2 is problematic, as I understand it, installation of Mojave automatically formats disk to ASPS.

Not as desired.

APFS is a better file management system. It is optimized for SSDs, but can be used on HDDs. A startup HDD might take somewhat of a performance hit under APFS, but not a deal-breaker hit for most.

Yosemite mail was when POP was still extant, so the software has option of storing on computer

So my workaround for mail backup is to manually copy from iCloud to old folder

I expect that is not possible with newer mail. So how to backup mail to my own computer.

Yosemite Mail is problematic moving forward, as are Mojave and Catalina mail and browsers as well. The mail, browser and network apps running in obsolete and unsupported OS versions will continue to decline in secure capability as time goes by. Websites continue to require modern secure browsers to access, and browsers that run in obsolete OSs are losing on that front. The community is full of posts asking why someone can't access their fav bank or shopping website anymore. Your '18 mini can run the latest OS browsers and will continue to remain relevant for the foreseeable future.

APFS https://umatechnology.org/understanding-apfs-the-new-file-system-from-apple/

Confusion about copy and clone

Did you finally read the conclusion of that article on APFS?

❝Its innovative features are geared toward handling the demands of current and future storage technologies, particularly the increasing ubiquity of solid-state drives.❞ and

❝the overall advantages of APFS position it as a forward-looking file system designed to evolve❞

Mojave is as far as I go

Catalina not intel software friendly.

32 but not a problem

Everything developed for the Mac since 2018/2019 is written for a modern OS using 64-bit coding. The applications are impressive. The hardware is impressive. The data is secure, the bugs get fixed and the support is there.

The world turns regardless of whether we want it to or not.

Pat Schaefer wrote:

[...]

My latest take. Mojave will boot on a HDD

but Apple doesn't want that so it makes like if you do

its a hackintosh and no computer o' mine.

Untrue. Apple doesn't care if you install Mojave on an HDD, and they don't consider that to be a "hackintosh" in any way. They won't service a Mac that has Mojave installed simply because any Mac that Mojave can install to is obsolete. Apple doesn't service obsolete computers. The last Mac mini that can run Mojave - without being hacked - is the late-2014 model. It's obsolete.

I noticed in your haste to jump on your soapbox you forgot to answer my question:

"So how to backup mail to my own computer."

Soapbox? Just trying to be helpful, my friend. Many eyes may see this.

Your lack of punctuation (?) in your post helped me to miss that question.

A: In the Mail app you create mail boxes in the location "On My Mac" and you drag your emails into that from the inbox. Done. Wanna bring those to a new computer? Export and import those "On my Mac" mailboxes. In addition, Time Machine also does backup mail that you have downloaded to your Mac.

[...]

when people say how fast it copies data

they are not actually copying the data just the pointers

True. Why waste storage space on a copy when a single file can be referenced many times without eating storage resources?

[...]

Mojave is as far as I go

Catalina not intel software friendly.

32 but not a problem

Catalina is in fact Intel processor and app friendly, as is every macOS version since 10.4 Tiger in 2006.

Intel compatibility is not Catalina's problem. The reason old apps break in Catalina and newer OS versions is because of the way they were coded in development; using outdated 32-bit language. 64-bit coding has technical advantages over the old way, including greater memory access. Progress.

Also, when Apple released macOS 11 Big Sur, they released Rosetta 2 translator. This allows Intel apps to be run on Macs built on Apple Silicon. Bases covered. If you need to install Rosetta on your Mac - Apple Support

and you have to look closely to see what you have lost

Fortunately, we each get to decide whether the loss is worth the gain. I'm happy not to have to feed the horse and muck the stall to get to work.

Jumping down from my soapbox now. 😉

Oh, is THAT all?!

I thought this might be something difficult. 🙂

It's easy as 1-2-3.

1• Get your '18 mini and set up to boot to Mojave. Use whatever format works on the internal drive.

2• Get your new 8TB ext drive and install Mojave on that. If it's an SSD, yes, the format will be APFS, and that's fine. SSDs are fast and APFS is an improved drive format, better than Mac OS Extended/HFS.

3• Connect the old external drive to the new mini and continue to use it as external storage. If you like you can access those files and copy them to the new external, or not. Either way they will be accessible from the new mini.

But also, don't forget:

4• Get another external drive to use as a Time Machine backup drive or use another backup solution.

Regarding pitfalls:

• You can still use email on the new mini just as well as it was on the '09 Mac.
• Safari will have equal access as what you have now, which is already age limited.

I would suggest you use SSDs with the '18 mini. They're fast and getting more affordable every day. APFS format is pretty advanced, too. Drive volumes can be added and removed easily, drive space sharing is automatic. It's pretty solid. More info about that if you need it.

EDIT -

5• After you have the '18 mini running Mojave, for the most part your apps and utilities will all continue to run. The next macOS upgrade, 10.15 Catalina, will break all of your 32-bit apps. But I suspect you know this already.

The cost of HDD vs SSD is speed. And the fact that SSDs hit the wallet just a little harder when it's time to buy.

Finder is the file manager and it knows how to access HFS and APFS disks.

Generally, apps don't care a whit what the drive format is. When it comes time to save or open a file they handoff to Finder to get that job done. They don't care the format of the drive they live on nor the format of the drive they store files on. With the Finder doing the work it can be mix-n-match. They DO care the OS version they can be used with, so system requirements matter.

Reading and Writing files to a Mac OS Extended (Journaled) formatted external drive works just fine.

For example: Our 2018 Mac mini that originally came Mojave (APFS) is now running Sequoia. We have no slowness or issues reading and writing to various external drives (SSD or HDD) that are formatted Mac OS Extended (Journaled), exFAT or FAT32.

Plan ahead, my friend.

Limiting yourself to continue running only Mojave is shortsighted. Mojave is obsolete, but the Mac mini can run the current newest version of the OS. I think it would be in your best interest run the most current OS you can get your hands on. Your internet experience will be vastly superior with anything from macOS 13 Ventura forward than it will be if you stick with Mojave. And the useful life of the computer will be increased by several years while the frustration factor will drop dramatically.

Your 2018 mini will run any OS from macOS 10.14 Mojave (obsolete) up to and including the current macOS 15 Sequoia. If you use

Unless you have some very compelling reason to stick with an obsolete and unsupported OS, you will be doing yourself no good service.

Yes, many of the applications you may be using now will have to be upgraded, none of the Apple apps will because those are automatically upgraded with the OS. There have bee many changes in computer tech since 2009. You are on the verge of jumping a big chasm between Yosemite and Sequoia, and i advise you to take the leap.

Don't worry about drive format APFS. Yes, the internal drive of the new mini should (must?) be that. But the Mac should come prepared with everything needed for you to move forward. And any external drive that your '09 Mac can use, so can the new mini. If you want to install Mojave on an external HDD, then it should also be formatted with APFS. The installer will reformat the drive if required.

To add, if you do decide to upgrade beyond 10.14 Mojave, your older 32-bit apps & drivers won’t work! They must also be updated or replaced. Use this free utility> Go64 app from St. Claire Software to check your currently installed apps to discover which apps will be affected.

You want your Mac mini to have a long productive life, so don't cut it short by sticking with obsolete software. Rip off the bandaid and embrace the change. 🙂

I respectfully disagree with your analogy.

Apple has no requirement that you RENT anything from them. Nor do I believe they are pushing anyone in any way to do something they don't wish to do.

Regarding iCloud: this is a free service that is provided as way to synchronize access to files across Apple devices such as the Mac, iPad and iPhone. In fact, the first 5GB of files access storage space is provided free to anyone who has an Apple Account (Apple ID). Of course, if you find you can use more storage in the cloud, Apply will happily rent that extra space to you, but you are never obligated. You really don't even have to take advantage of any part of iCloud services if you don't wish it.

Actually, if you wish to operate your Mac without an Apple Account at all, you can do that. Doing that may limit your choices when it comes to accessing a vast library of apps for the Mac and your Apple devices, but that can be worked around.

Apple Accounts are a free and secure way to connect and secure access to multiple devices and personal information.

If you simply want to setup your Mac as a standalone, air-gapped computer that is absolutely do-able with the modern macOS. But there are plenty of reasons why you might take advantage of the basic, free abilities and security of the modern Mac and macOS.

There are plenty of folks here in the support Community who are willing to offer guidance and help, too.

All available for free!

And if security of your personal data on your personal computer and data is important to you, then all the more reason to avoid using an obsolete and unsupported macOS Mojave and any web browser that can run in that OS.

Respectfully.

The 2018 Mac mini came with Mojave macOS 10.14 from the factory and it can not run anything earlier.

The Mac mini's internal drive is and will be formatted APFS and there is no way around that.

External drives can be formatted Mac OS Extended (Journaled) or APFS.